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Pretty good for a year old. My other main teacher back then was a Swami in the Kriya Yoga tradition by the name of Goswami Kriyananda. There are several teachers by that name, but this one was Goswami Kriyananda, from Chicago. To make a long story short, I became absolutely fascinated by the subject, almost obsessed, because what I began to see was how uncanny it was not only with prediction, but with understanding psychology.
Those first two teachers were at opposite ends of the spectrum, in a way. He was very much into teaching traditional sources and techniques, though he also taught a more spiritual dimension to astrology. It was an absolutely fascinating education being exposed to such different approaches, and I try to incorporate both of those now in my own work. I began to take on clients fairly early and started to develop my own sense of the discipline. Let me back up a little bit. Conversely, I also began to understand how astrology helps to explain synchronicity, and so my first book The Waking Dream actually arose in part out of an effort to understand the ways astrology can expand our understanding of synchronicity beyond just a sense of isolated coincidences into something far more all-embracing.
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I continued to explore various aspects of astrology, such as mundane astrology and how it relates to cinema and the arts, and also the doctrine of the chakras and how it relates to astrology, for example. I hope that answers your question in some way. Can you please name three people who most influenced your way of thinking? Why them? By far those three individuals have shaped my understanding. What does astrology mean for you? On the second level, the collective, you can talk about how astrology illuminates the life of societies, of entire generations, of the world. Then, on the universal level, you can talk about astrology as an archetypal language of existence, and how the zodiacal signs, the planets and the different aspects represent a symbolic code to understanding the Divine Mind, the Mind of God, you could say.
And so my study of astrology has been on all three of these levels. I believe you can place all other facets of astrology pretty much under that three-fold umbrella. But there is clearly an organizing principle by which everything interrelates. In a sense, you could almost say that the main message of synchronicity and astrology is that everything interlocks. Now, if I had walked out the door few minutes earlier or later, I might never have met that person. So what brought us together at that precise moment when the heavens were aligned that way?
Likewise you can talk about someone who has a difficult aspect in their chart and they wind up crossing paths with a thief who robs them. Who or what is choreographing everything like that? Is it a giant being, or is it some abstract organizing principle? But yes, I do believe there is something along these lines, absolutely.
ADRIAN : I asked this question because there are a lot of people who perceive a contradiction between astrology and religious beliefs or spirituality. RAY : Right. This is an age old theological problem, of course, and over the last years astrology has fallen both in and out of fashion with the Church, depending to some extent on how the Church has viewed nature at any given time. If nature is the instrument of God, for instance, then there is no real problem reconciling astrology with the notion of God.
Daily love horoscope astrolis aquarius
I asked him, do you ever watch the weather report on TV? No, not any more than the knowing the weather does. You always have free will in how you respond to the signs and symbols that astrology reveals. For example two people can be born at the same time and still have very different lives, they can choose to manifest the horoscope differently. A metaphor I often use is how you can give a piece of sheet music to two different performers, and one of them might be a jazz musician, while the other might be Vladimir Horowitz, a more classically-trained performer.
But we should address the problem of determinism versus the free will. RAY : Yes, but remember—astrology talks in a language of symbolism , and when you talk in a language of symbols you always have octaves of meaning. So you actually have a certain amount of control over the octave at what you express that energy.
And they both had transiting Saturn crossing over their natal Neptune virtually at the exact same time, in both cases about a week before I met with them. I asked both of them what happened about a week earlier, when Saturn was exactly on top of their Neptune. The first client said that he got arrested for drunk driving at the time, while the second client said he joined AA the Alcoholics Anonymous in order to quit alcohol!
Think about that. It was the same planetary symbolism, but in the latter case the client decided to manifest the symbolism from the inside out , you might say, by using the Saturnian discipline to voluntarily stop their drinking. So it was the same symbolism in both cases, because their charts were quite similar at the moment, yet they chose to manifest the Saturn-Neptune in completely different ways.
There was free will in how they chose to respond to the stars. Does that answer your question? There are so many contradictory perspectives in this world of astrology, like the Vedic and Western and so on. But the most confusing thing is they all seem to have results.
How is this possible? How do I put this? Let me frame this in a broader context. And each of these has its own particular framework of meaning and symbolism. So you may get a slightly different answer going to a palmist then you will from a tarot reader, or from an astrologer or a crystal ball reader; an astrologer might be better at timing while a tarot reader might be better at certain other things, for example.
Likewise, there are different frameworks of symbolism within astrology itself. And they can each comment on your life from different perspectives, but they may not come up with exactly the same answers. So a Vedic Astrologer can be quite accurate, and using their particular system and very different perspective they will come up with their own set of answers. Along a similar line, by the way, I wrote an article for Mountain Astrologer that will be coming out later this year which suggests a possible way of reconciling Tropical Astrology and Sidereal Astrology.
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Now let me add something else here. As I said, I do believe some astrological systems are better at certain things than others. I had a yoga scholar come to me years ago who was born with a close Sun-square-Moon. When I looked at his chart, I saw that transiting Pluto was sitting right on top of his Virgo Moon, and triggering that natal square. Among other things, I mentioned that that could be producing some very serious stomach problems—which is when I learned he was dealing with ulcers.
He wondered aloud to me why neither of the Vedic astrologers he saw had come up with that, and I told him that it was probably because those Vedic Astrologers did not use the outer planets and so missed that powerful Pluto aspect. On the other hand, there are some things that a Vedic Astrologer might come up with that I might miss entirely, using their particular framework of symbolism. Now, does that shed some light on your question? Would you like to discuss about the most common objection towards astrology and how to reply to it?
RAY : Sure, happy to give it a try. How would you reply to it? Or how can an astrological chart still operate after someone dies, like when you see when a dead celebrity suddenly come back into the news? There are so many different things like that. A big part of the reason why I wrote The Waking Dream was to try to place astrology into a broader world view, within a framework of symbolic thinking. Because I see both astrology and synchronicity as part of a symbolist world view, one that sees the world as a kind of dream, as a symbolic language. Whereas an astrologer sees everything—not just the planets, but everything—as infused with meaning, with symbolism.
To them, the world is permeated by a hidden, somewhat invisible framework of correspondences. They would analyze the letters on each page under a microscope, they could weigh the book on a scale, and do all sorts of things. But to understand the meaning of the book requires a more hermeneutic strategy, a more symbolic mindset.
It may not yield its secrets to conventional scientific testing, true, but it does stands up to empirical testing of that more personal sort, where you actually experience its meaning and symbolism for yourself, whether that takes one year or twenty. ADRIAN : Do you think that at some point in time the science will eventually discover how astrology works, maybe through some invisible rays or energy fields of some sort?
As with many indigenous traditions around the world, when a child was born in a tribe, you looked to see what was happening in the environment. So if a deer was running by at the moment the child was born, you might call the child Running Deer. The child was born in a moment in time that was imbued with a particular matrix of meaningfulness and symbolism, and so reflected that matrix of meaning.
Those may all play their part. But the fundamental basis of astrology, in my opinion, is symbolism and meaning. One has to be very careful about how one delivers negative news, too. You have to find a way of framing the problem so that they see it in a more hopeful light. How do you reframe the problems and challenges in the stars, and how do you give the client a sense of possibility rather than impossibility? In fact, that Mars-square-Moon has many facets and levels, so you can also talk to that person about their strong warrior energy and how it can be used in more positive ways for constructive change.
I think some of the same problems which attend astrology attend the field of psychology, too.
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Just as there are both good and bad astrologers, there are good and bad psychologists. You might also see astrologers misusing astrology in broader ways, on the mundane, socio-political level, by inserting their own biases into their interpretations. I remember years ago when an astrologer predicted that astrology showed California was going to fall into the ocean on a certain date, which panicked a lot of people.
I could probably go on, but those are a few of the things that come to mind. Does that address your question? During the twentieth century there were some revolutions happening in astrology, and you were a contemporary with at least one of them, which occurred in the seventies—the psychological orientation. Can you say some words about these revolutions, and maybe we can predict what the next one might be? RAY : As far as I see it, there have been three major revolutions which have taken place in astrology over the last century or so.
The first of those would be the psychological shift. Carl Jung and Freud were largely responsible for that, in terms of their influence seeping into astrology. Now, you did have inklings of psychology in astrology before the 20 th century, no doubt about it. Quite a few centuries ago, you could find comments about certain character traits as indicated by certain zodiacal signs or planetary aspects. As I said, my first two teachers were at different ends of that spectrum. Maureen Cleary was far more oriented towards psychology, and while Kriyananda had a deep grasp of the spiritual dimensions of astrology, he regarded psychological astrology as too often being very vague, and not practical enough.
Funny enough, there was actually more overlap between their approaches than either of them seemed to realize, because Kriyananda could be very insightful in his interpretations about psychology oftentimes, and Maureen Cleary could be very astonishingly accurate when talking about the practical side of what the chart showed. So I think the division between their approaches was not quite as big as it first appeared.
I remember when I was first doing astrology, how long it took just to construct a chart, especially when it came to things like progressions. As a result, you now have a new crop of astrologers who are quite brilliant and who can draw upon and benefit from the research of their colleagues, as well as from those who came before. Which leads me to the third shift in astrology, which has been the rediscovery of the ancient traditions , whether those be Medieval or Hellenistic, Chinese, Arabic, and so on. I had a new student not too long ago who said they felt actually overwhelmed by all the astrological information out there, since they believed they had learn it all in order to become a good astrologer.
I said to them, no, not necessarily. For some people, it would be better to just put down your stakes in one territory and develop that as much as possible before taking in everything. RAY : Okay, I had a client come to me who had been to an astrologer who was extremely well-versed in many aspects of astrology—modern, Hellenistic, Evolutionary, etcetera. It was simply too much of a good thing, in other words. I looked at her chart and saw that she had a very tough energy, a tight Saturn-Pluto-Moon in the fifth house involved in a wider T-square.
It was an especially difficult pattern, and I spent most of the reading focusing on it, because I intuitively sensed it was perhaps the most important challenge in her life. She was in tears by the end of the reading, because it turns out she had been abused as a child, had several miscarriages, and this was the area she was really most curious about.
So there were many other things I could have spoken about in her chart, but sometimes less is more. And so having all this information now at our fingertips can be extremely useful, but we have to be selective, we have to be somewhat cautious in how we use it. But so, those are the three revolutions, if we can call them that: the psychological, the technological, and the historical, or the resurrection of those older traditions. Now, what was your other question? In the same way, if you had asked an astrologer in to predict what was going to happen to astrology in the twentieth century, how could they possibly had foreseen any of these three movements?
Some of my colleagues are now involved in trying to create a synthesis of existing elements, of bridging Eastern and Western astrology, of Western psychological with Eastern or Vedic systems. Or I suppose you could get really speculative, when it comes to future trends in astrology. For instance what would astrology look like on another planet? Or for someone traveling beyond the solar system entirely? What would the chart for an alien from another solar system look like, with a different set of planets altogether? And how would you know what the third planet from the Sun in the system Alpha Centauri means, for example?
Or what would astrology be like in a solar system with two suns? What is the astrology of black holes? There are so many different factors that might play into this, but those are a few speculations. Most probably these will be systems able to learn and to evolve somehow, maybe to think for themselves, too.
Do you see any progress driven by the advent of this new technology? RAY : Well, it is an interesting question. No question. What does that really means? And what does technology symbolize? By the way, if you move each of those letters up one step in the alphabet, notice how you get IBM! In the old myths, the old traditions, the hero slays a dragon, which is a more instinctual, more emotional symbol. But in the movie , Dave Bowman, the astronaut, has to slay a robot.
So, what does that symbolize? And I think the possibility that AI could rise up and take over is symbolic of the way our dry, sterile rationality could overpower us, or even eclipse our spiritual nature. Another major focus for me has been mundane astrology, in terms of how astrology sheds light on cultural movements. That was the focus on my second book, Signs of the Times. I been focusing a lot lately on the outer planets, Uranus, Neptune and Pluto, and how those play into personal horoscopes. I mentioned the chakras, and I think that applies not just to individuals but to our collective experience.
In my book The Waking Dream , for example particularly chapter 11 , I tried to take what I learned from my studies of sacred geometry and from my conversations with teachers in the Kriya Yoga tradition, and hopefully shed some light on the deeper implications of astrology on that level. I believe that synchronicity is a far more expansive kind of phenomena than we see with just isolated coincidences—and astrology is the perfect example of that.
And it virtually proves to me that there is a transcendental dimension to our world, and to my world. It also gives you an understanding of the good, so-called auspicious energies, which you can take advantage of. So those are some things that I would say in answer to that. Can you give one or two examples? RAY : It depends on the transit. That might be good in its own way, but Saturn is there to teach you something about your limitations, too, or about letting go of excess baggage in your life. Like high-risk mountain climbing. But personally, if Saturn were squaring my chart in powerful ways, I would be considerably more cautious!
Or, if Mercury is retrograde and is squaring Saturn, is that a good time to start writing a book? Personally, I think not. Editing it, sure—but starting it? On a positive note, if I have a fantastic Jupiter transit coming up, that might be a time for planning a trip overseas. Different transits are good for different things, so that when I had Uranus trining my Mercury, I chose that as the time to write my second book on the Aquarian Age. When Jupiter was crossing my 9 th house, that was a time that I did a long-distance trip. Now, if Saturn was trining or conjuncting my Neptune, say, I might take that as a time to work on my spiritual practice, or some artistic project.
Do you use any technique in particular?